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putnam6 · 12-11-2023, 09:13 PM

Excellent video both sides are represented by real persons, one thing they agreed on we are all being manipulated by our government and media. Well that and America stirs the pot quite a bit.

[Video: https://youtu.be/fo_nWmRGi_o?si=o8AgCN1wjSreboZz]

Lysergic · 12-11-2023, 09:51 PM

It's not possible to be both Pro-Israel and Pro-Palestine....

So says the video.

Yet it's entirely possible to be both Anti-Israel and Anti-Palestine, so sayeth the wise.

I rather just be Pro-American fuck the rest.

putnam6 · 12-12-2023, 12:06 AM

(12-11-2023, 09:51 PM)Lysergic Wrote: It's not possible to be both Pro-Israel and Pro-Palestine....

So says the video.

Yet it's entirely possible to be both Anti-Israel and Anti-Palestine, so sayeth the wise.

I rather just be Pro-American fuck the rest.

The American isolationist view, which I agree with 100% BTW, died a long time ago I'd say circa April 6, 1917, if not much earlier. It isn't coming back at least not on this planet.

It's also very American to stick their genitalia into other countries' business while spouting their thoughts and ideas when it is overwhelmingly obvious those countries are talking about a specific issue and aren't interested in the American opinion. Much like this thread, It ain't always about America.

**Brogdel** · 12-22-2023, 11:37 PM

The English did this in Northern Ireland, they are still fighting. How did they think this would work in for Israel?

putnam6 · 12-23-2023, 05:53 AM

(12-22-2023, 11:37 PM)Brogdel Wrote: The English did this in Northern Ireland, they are still fighting. How did they think this would work in for Israel?

There are some parallels, but Israel and the Palestinian question is its own barbaric animal. Hell I dont think we can look at the Middle East through 70s glasses anymore. After all if ballistic missiles were flying over Saudi Arabia the 70s me would be thinking they were Israeli missiles and this was the opening salvo of WWIII

Lots of string is being pulled leading to nothing but knots currently.

Generally, though the consensus in some semi-knowledgeable and rational circles is Hamas was shocked by how widespread and long-lasting 10/7 attack was. They weren't prepared for 200 plus hostages, but expected the Arab world to rally around them. That last mistake is probably the last mistake they will ever make.

There are 2 Arab worlds now, one that atleast sees the 21st century and another stuck in the 17th-century religious dogma. One of them has a future one of them does not. Countries like Iran have used religious fanatism as a population control mechanism, propped up by Russia it's a dated and dying idea.

IMHODFAPBSM

Kwaka · 12-23-2023, 07:56 AM

It was a tough debate to watch with so many involved. Lot of ra ra bickering where no one had a voice. The vibe of how apologetic the Israel side was to we have to kill you is the reality of the situation.

I did not hear any look them in the eye as they take their life, more of a retreat in legalize as the they look at the ground as Israel says sorry, but you must die.

I don't agree with everything Max Igan has to say. For someone that has been to Gaza and does have friends there, he makes some strong points about this situation. Warning, the following link does contain some horror of war.

Let's Talk About The Jews

The reported number of dead is highly under reported. What is to happen to these people as Northern Gaza spreads south? They are locked in, no where to go. So does the media say 50K dead at the end while 2.3 Million just disappeared? It is Israel's game plan on this round table.

Since waking up to 9/11, I don't trust Israel. It took a few years of German aggression for the rest of the world to say enough back in WW2. Israel is on the same path with how much hate they have. With this round table discussion, it is already a global issue. As for when and how much it takes to stop this train? I don't like its destination.

crayzeed · 12-23-2023, 09:04 AM

What I don't understand is the UN pontificating. Why isn't the UN blitzing the place with "peace keepers"? THEY should be disarming the Hamas terrorists (to provide the Palestinian people a safe place to live) and sending the Israeli army and Israeli hostages back.

putnam6 · 12-23-2023, 09:08 AM

(12-23-2023, 07:56 AM)Kwaka Wrote: It was a tough debate to watch with so many involved. Lot of ra ra bickering where no one had a voice. The vibe of how apologetic the Israel side was to we have to kill you is the reality of the situation.

I did not hear any look them in the eye as they take their life, more of a retreat in legalize as the they look at the ground as Israel says sorry, but you must die.

I don't agree with everything Max Igan has to say. For someone that has been to Gaza and does have friends there, he makes some strong points about this situation. Warning, the following link does contain some horror of war.

Let's Talk About The Jews

The reported number of dead is highly under reported. What is to happen to these people as Northern Gaza spreads south? They are locked in, no where to go. So does the media say 50K dead at the end while 2.3 Million just disappeared? It is Israel's game plan on this round table.

Since waking up to 9/11, I don't trust Israel. It took a few years of German aggression for the rest of the world to say enough back in WW2. Israel is on the same path with how much hate they have. With this round table discussion, it is already a global issue. As for when and how much it takes to stop this train? I don't like its destination.

Yeah, I stumble over that before, I'll have to listen all the way through, but generally, I prefer more viewpoints that one person with a narrative monologue.

Don't know where you are going with the totals, are they not published by the Gazan Health Ministry?

Regardless for proper perspective, we need to see the final totals compared to the recent Arab on Arab conflicts for example the Syrian Civil War.

Certainly wasn't protested, yet as always America stuck its nose into the fray, did it not? Or am I misremembering?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syrian_civil_war

Quote:Casualties and losses
Total killed
580,000[3]–613,407+[4]
Civilians killed
306,887+[5][6]
(according to UN, until March 2021)
Displaced
6.7 million internally
6.6 million externally (refugees) (March 2021)[7]
vte
Syrian civil war

FlyersFan · This post was last modified 12-23-2023, 10:13 AM by FlyersFan.

(12-23-2023, 09:04 AM)crayzeed Wrote: What I don't understand is the UN pontificating. Why isn't the UN blitzing the place with "peace keepers"? THEY should be disarming the Hamas terrorists (to provide the Palestinian people a safe place to live) and sending the Israeli army and Israeli hostages back.

The UN can't disarm Hamas. The UN has NOT declared it a terrorist organization. And Hamas is supported by 75% of Palestinians (last poll I saw), so the UN can't go in and take away the chosen leadership of the Palestinian people. The Palestinians WANT Hamas.

(12-23-2023, 09:08 AM)putnam6 Wrote: Don't know where you are going with the totals, are they not published by the Gazan Health Ministry?

There really isn't a 'Gazan Health Ministry'. That sounds like a legitimate government agency. That's Hamas calling itself that. The numbers are all from Hamas.

putnam6 · 12-23-2023, 10:22 AM

(12-23-2023, 10:09 AM)FlyersFan Wrote: The UN can't disarm Hamas. The UN has NOT declared it a terrorist organization. And Hamas is supported by 75% of Palestinians (last poll I saw), so the UN can't go in and take away the chosen leadership of the Palestinian people. The Palestinians WANT Hamas.

There really isn't a 'Gazan Health Ministry'. That sounds like a legitimate government agency. That's Hamas calling itself that. The numbers are all from Hamas.

Yes, I am well aware, Broad Street Bully Brother...

I trust no source from Gaza, the sheer fact Israel has been able to pull this off without it expanding too much so far speaks volumes...